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Credo Mutwa Reptilians


October 25, 2002 - Transcript of conversation with Roger Elvick
Conversation with Roger and N* or R and N

N:    I’ve been reading your transcripts and of course I talked to you on the conference call and we’ve got an arraignment on Thurs.  There are 4 of us.  They had my preliminary hearing last week and of course they don’t let you plead there.  I wanted to right to the appearance bond and plead there and they wouldn’t let me but now they have their official charge so Thursday, which is ten days later, they scheduled the arraignment.  So the other guys had their preliminary hearings today and they’re jamming them in on Thursday also.  So they only have two days notice for this arraignment.   So all 4 of us are this Thursday.  I thought it was kind of odd that they ran those guys in two days later too.
R:    Well I’m not going to speculate on that.  But we’ll just have to get right to the nuts and bolts …
N:    Okay!  Nuts and bolts are the plan as you have said we’re going in there requesting an appearance bond to enable us to plead to the charges… I’m not going into the whole script but they’re probably going to want to dishonor that.  It seems that we have become very hot and very political out here for all of us because we’ve made all the papers and they want to make examples of all of us.  
R:    Well not to get it too broad here… keep the other people out of it here cause you tend to speculate on what they’re going to do and bla bla bla.  You just need to be concerned with yourself….   because you can’t do something about somebody else’s situation anyway.
N:    Right
R:    Anyhow,…   you’re moving into an arraignment?  So the arraignment is okay but it’s based on what?  On a charge?
N:    Yes!
R:    Okay but where is the charge?  Where’s the attorney’s check?
N:    I…  I accepted and returned ..
R:    Yeah but he didn’t provide a check!
N:    No he did not.
R:    Were you guys ever served any papers?
N:    Yes, I just got them in the mail today.
R:    Okay!  You got them in the mail?
N:    Mumhum…
R:    Well then you better return them immediately.
N:    Oh yes definitely.
R:    And don’t keep any of them.
N:    Oh don’t keep them?
R:    Hell no!  You’ve got to return everything… envelopes and all.   You don’t keep any token of anything they have ever given you.   You always return those.  
N:    Okay…  So I would write across them:  Accepted and Returned.
R:    Yeah you can but make sure that you return them.  I’ll just tell you about an incident that I had recently.  US Marshal came to me and served a subpoena on me…
N:    Yeah I remember that and you shoved them into his gut and he ran like a scared chicken..
R:    Well they just ran to their vehicle and got out of there quickly but it did the job because they were saying, “You go get a voucher and you go over there and what you need to pay… and I said, “Don’t you have a check?” and he said, “No.”  and I said, “No check – no subpoena.”  And I handed it back to him.  
N:    Okay I’ll return the originals and run over to the county seat where they do this and I’ll just run into the clerks office and I’ll return it to the clerk and say, “Accepted and returned.”  And I’ll write on it ACCEPTED for VALUE, RETURNED for VALUE for SETTLEMENT AND CLOSURE.  THERE WAS NO CHECK INCLUDED.
R:    Yes!  I did not find a check…!
N:    …I did not find a check…
R:    So you see they’re going to probably try to run the arraignment or whatever, but you see these are still preliminary proceedings.
N:    Right.
R:    They’re on a fishing trip.  They’re trying to get you to stumble into the game for them.
N:    So if they ask me my name should I just go right to the:  “Do you have a claim against me?”
R:    That’s right…  “What is your name?”  “Do you have a claim against me?”  “Do you know anyone else that does?”  
N:    See I notice that at all the hearings we’ve been going to they never ask us our name.  
R:    Well they’re waiting for you to condemn yourself.  The other thing is you probably should get into writing a notice of your intent to file a chapter 11 reorganization in bankruptcy.   
N:    I did send an Intent to the prosecutor.  I sent him my Intent to file a chapter 11 reorganization if they refuse to close and settle on this matter.   Should I notice the clerk and the judge or just the prosecutor?
R:    Well I suppose whoever has made an offer of some kind to you.
N:    Oh!  That’ll be the prosecutor then.  
R:    Not only that, since this is a matter of equity you see they then belonging to a business organization of the local cardinal and the local bishop then if they dishonor your request for settlement, you see, that is cause then to discover the personal assets of the cardinal and the bishop as they are the temporal leaders of this particular organization.  That’s who these unjust stewards belong to.  Then what you want to do is get the name of the local bishop and cardinal and do a UCC 11 on them and start to move towards discovery of their personal assets.   Not only that, the reason is so that you can discover the assets and liquidate them in the administrative procedures of bankruptcy.  
N:    Now one of the guys in L* is doing a chapter 13 right now with them.  He was in jail and he filed a chapter 13 and they got him out of jail immediately.  
R:    Well that may.  I don’t know what those circumstances are.    All I know is what an 11 is.  
N:    Okay.  I don’t remember… he said the chapter 13 had something to do with the creditors having to prove that they actually have a claim.   Is how the 13 is structured and immediately they put him out of jail is because the 13 worked as far as he understood that all property has to be released until it’s settled.   So he was thrown out of jail immediately.  
R:    Oh okay!  That may well be, I don’t know.  
N:    Yeah I don’t either.  
R:    Well what I’m after is I’m after property.  That’s why I’m using the 11 and the 11 is a voluntary petition and that’s the way you get evidence.  See when you accept their offers see that’s taking the evidence into the bankruptcy.  You see if they fail to make settlement when you give them a request of the remedy and you give them an notice of intent to file a chapter 11 all your business activities--- 90 days prior to the filing are actually part of the bankruptcy.
N:    Oh yeah and that’s been within 90 days.  All this has.
R:    Yeah!  So that’s what you do you give them notice of your intent to file the bankruptcy and if they fail to make settlement with you, see then they have authorized discovery of their personal property in the bankruptcy proceedings.  They’ve authorized it by dishonoring you, see, so they loose all their equity when that happens.  
N:    Right!  Unclean hands.
R:    Yes.  So you need to give them notice of that and you see that prosecutor is probably going to try and allude things in court that he doesn’t disclose what the action is.  In other words, like I have occasionally had collectors call here sometimes and they say, “Well I’m collecting for So and So and bla bla bal.”  And then they always go into the word ‘we’.  So when I ask them, “Are you the holder of my account?”  She said, “Yes we are.”  Then I said, “Well who is we?”  and then they try to give the run around.  They don’t want to tell who’s ‘we’.  They just go on and ask other questions.   Well this is the way the prosecutor acts too because he doesn’t want to disclose what the agreement is when he’s going into court because you see it’s against the law for him to practice law without a license and that’s what he’s doing because he’s laying in there with the idea of we which assumes to be an assessment.   An assessment is an agreement.  That’s what they use their presumptions to come out of that particular arraignment with so that they can now use an assessment to charge a claim to bind you over for trial.  
N:    Okay.
R:    So you see that’s why you want to make sure that the prosecutor discloses everything that he is asserting to the court.   So you want to watch him in these little assertions … like ‘we’.  You want to make damn sure that he describes who ‘we’ is.  Not just he, it’s he and someone else.  He’s assuming that you and I have an agreement, that’s what he’s assuming.
N:    Objection, who is we? Or something like that?
R:    Yeah!  
N:    Something like, ‘Objection your honor, who is we?’  Course I don’t know how it can get that far if they can’t get my name.
R:    They just keep on moving to assume whether they’re going to prevail or not is neither here nor there.   The other thing is that if the judge signs anything contrary to your interests in there you also want a certified copy of the finding of fact and the conclusion of law, because that is going to bind the judge then instead of the attorney.  In other words the judge is now going to be the one who holds the bond instead of the attorney if he wants to take that.  But see usually they never do that.  If you just move for say a Motion to Dismiss… okay?  And the judge denies the motion… then he has the obligation to provide also the finding of fact and conclusion of law.  You can probably ask for that and I don’t think you’ll ever find it in the administrative file.  
N:    It’d be in the judicial file.  
R:    Right!  It’ll be in the judicial file, if there is one.   If there isn’t one now you see the judge is subject with providing you with immediate remedy or else he’s subject then to discovery of his personal assets in bankruptcy.  That’s why I use chapter 11.
N:    Okay.  That makes since.  I can understand that.   All right so we start the court out by moving for dismissal and then they deny that then …  Well should I go the for the appearance bond first then to the dismissal?
R:    Well…  I don’t know.  You’re going to have to figure your strategy rather then us pick it up on a conversation about this.
N:    I understand…  All right!  There are 3 different tools that you’ve provided us with that I think are very good remedies is the appearance bond, the chapter 11, and the finding of facts and conclusion of law and of course the dismissing…  yeah.
R:    See because if you get a finding of fact and conclusion of law, you see what they are trying to do is they’re trying to obtain an assessment, which is civil so they can move into the criminal.   They have to have an assessment before they can charge a claim and that’s criminal.  
N:    How does he get an assessment then?
R:    Well he’s going to assume it for one thing… probably.  Or just like I said when they say ‘we’ are collecting your account.  Well who is we?  He gave me his name, but when he is saying we, that’s how come the question when you depose him is:  May I have your name?  Do you have a claim against me? Do you know anyone else who has a claim against me?  That covers who is ‘we’.  So you see this is the area where that attorney is trying to assume the assessment.
N:    I don’t think this prosecutor has a clue.  
R:    Just everybody that I’ve talked to about this that’s the comment that comes out and believe you me this is you are underestimating the attorney and how devious they are.  They might not be very smart but you see they are highly trained in areas like this.
N:    Okay… I accept that.
R:    Yet they are the lowest drags of humanity.   Because they taunt themselves to be virtuous and they are exactly opposite that.  
N:    They are trained in deception.  They win by deception.  
R:    Yea! Yea!  They are thieves.  Anyway they are going to find out that when we go after the cardinals and the bishops and they start to get widely recognized for the role that they play boy I’ll tell you it’s going to get hot for them.  
N:    Well we know the Vatican’s on top of the whole thing so it only makes since…
R:    Yeah but that’s just people’s hearsay.   There aren’t any people that have any believable evidence.   You’ll be laughed right out of the arena.
N:    Well you wouldn’t say those things, I’m just saying that we know the Vatican is behind it, so it’s a cinch they would be the over seers of the area.
R:    Yeah but you have to tie them together and that is what we’re going to do in bankruptcy and that’s what we’re going to use is the UCC 11’s.  We’re going to put them on there and run them on discovery.  
N:    Very interesting.  Boy that would be an embarrassment.
R:    Yeah but you can let those attorneys in your court case know that that’s the price they’re going to pay because they are a part of the business organization of the cardinals and bishops.  
N:    So go ahead and notify them of discover of the cardinals and bishops too?
R:    Sure, because the cardinals and bishops are the over seers of the spiritual.
N:    The ecclesiastical court.
R:    The ecclesiastical court of conscience for spiritual causes.  So you see that is the organization that you’re going to take into bankruptcy, you see?  They’re going to be listed and when they list their assets.  See the creditor is going to have to list their assets or he doesn’t have any.  If he doesn’t list any we want to know where this property is cause we’re going to go get it.
N:    Well don’t they take a vow of poverty where the elemonosery (?) their corporate sole, and they don’t hold property in a corporate sole.
R:    But they control it.
N:    True
R:    That’s the property that we’re after.  We’re saying that is my personal property Buddy and we’re coming to get it.  They think they can hold it off they got another think coming because once we get it into bankruptcy…  You’re going to have to file in the bankruptcy as the Authorized Representative.  You are NOT going to file as a pro se.
N:    Right.  It’ll be attorney in fact or authorized representative.  
R:    Right!
N:    I understand that Staples and Office Max and places like that have the bankruptcy kits is what people are telling me.   My buddy just went to Comp USA and picked one up and the clerk said, “Yeah just pay an attorney $100 and have him fill them out for you.”   He laughed and said, “You don’t have a clue what I’m doing with this thing.”  
R:    Well they think they can escape…   chuckles
N:    Well it’s all in the private side.  It’s private!  I know the judge tried to draw me into a controversy during this preliminary hearing he wanted me to grill all the witnesses and I just asked all the witnesses, “Do you have a claim against me?”  etc.  The questions… … “no”   Well that’s it.  But anyway, okay we’ll have to stick to that and learn how to think fast on my feet.  Are you good at that?  Thinking fast on your feet or does it come from practice?
R:    Oh I don’t know… probably both.   Hell we got a little of everything.  They try to surprise you, they’ll try every lowdown dastardly thing that they can, so you just have to hang loose and go with the flow.   All you can do.  There isn’t much else.
N:    Yeah I agree.  All right… thank you.  I deeply appreciate your time.  This will come back to you in aces I’ve known many, many people that have called you.  Like I said on the conference call that I first heard about you back in 1999 with that first transcript of Jean K*.  February of 99.  We got a hold of that and lot of things have changed since then but that’s where I first heard about you.  Anyway I appreciate you taking my call.
R:    Well there really aren’t any silver bullets.  You just have to take what tools you’ve got and work them out the best you can.  That’s all we can do for now.
N:    Right.  All of us never wanted to get thrown into the hot seat but hey we’re here.  So that’s the way it is.
R:    They’d like people to believe well it’s just because of your conduct that got you there but you see they were already sharpening their knives up here to prod you up into those areas anyway.  
N:    Oh you darn right!  There’s no other hope.  There’s no other remedy.  There’s nothing.  I mean all of us came from the common law nonsense and the statutes and all that nonsense that we all came out of and the conditional accepting and all of that and we’ve come to here.  There is nothing else.  This is it.  There is nowhere else to go for a remedy.  This is it.   It’s commercial and I don’t know what else to do.  So this is where I’m staying… no more backing up.  
R:    Yeah yep.  Those lying attorneys are going to have to get out of the way because we’re going to have their assets.  They think they can run through these artificial names of their wives or stuff like that but just let them know that the property that they own and control …
N:    And control…  Well it’s got to come to this point.   Oh hey I’ll tell you one that you might find interesting.  We just had one of the guys that we work with here just got a new truck out of Nampa, one of the big dealerships.  He went in and was just kind of cruising around and talked about buying a truck and they said, “Well lets see if we can get you any credit.”  Well the guy has no credit and if he did it’s lousy credit.  So he said, “Here take my private check.”  They took his closed check, called GMAC and they faxed the check to GMAC.  GMAC ran the check and said, “He has fabulous credit.  Sell him anything he wants, we’ll finance it.”  So he loaded up a truck with a 6-ton wench and the whole bit and got it all decked out, come up with an agreement.  Gave him 90 days to pay it off and he told GMAC he’d be sending them that check and they said. “Fine.”  
R:    Well they’re probably getting to the point where they have to take some deals like this.
N:    Well they’re not moving many trucks nowadays.  
R:    You see they get 100% exemption on there.  See they don’t have to sell it cheap or anything.  They get full suggested retail and you see the exemption covers all the checks that they’ve written against themselves.  Even if they’ve got stuff standing from other things as long as it fits under that amount of that financial blanket they get an exemption for it.  
N:    I’ve heard a rumor and you know how everybody talks about you… I think you have more rumors about you then probably anybody in the country right now.  Somebody told me or I had heard that you had something like 33 credit cards and you were using a private check to close them out every month and then they would send you another one.
R:    Naw!   Oh I’ve had a dozen or so of them and I use to close them out.  I didn’t pay for them by the month but whenever they gave me a bill then bang!  I’d just send them the whole amount.  I didn’t make payments.  Just whenever I’d use them and whenever the bill got to me… bang I’d just clean it all up.   But you see it got to be such a bookkeeping nuisance and they were hounding so I just decided it isn’t worth it.  I can just write a check.  I don’t need them damn cards.
N:    Good point.
R:    So I’ve got catalogues and when I order something I tell them, well you’ll have to take a check.  I don’t use credit cards.  Okay then some of them will say, “Then just give me the information over the phone and they do the electronic funds transfer right there on the spot.   Some of them will say, “No you’ll have to send it in because we’re not equipped to do that.”  Well okay, but then they’ve told me then when you do that write the invoice of the order right on the face of the check and I do that and it just zip…  
N:    I’ve done that over the phone and they’ll run the card and they’ll go, “Oh I’m sorry, that account is closed.”
R:    Right!  Are you now going to refuse to send the item because you’ve got my tax exemption now.   The electronic funds transfer is already done and so Buddy you better come across with the product of your offer or you’re liable to have some visitors from the treasury.    
N:    (laughing)  That’s perfect!  I love it.  That’s exactly right too.  You might have a knock on your front door…
R:    Yep.  But anyway no doubt and there will be an incident report on this.  I’ve got my own forms that I use for myself and I will just send them off to them the minute they get crossways because now we want to have the information because this is an electronic funds transfer.  It’s a treasury item.
N:    Are you talking about the incident report that E* came up with?
R:    Yep.     (This incident report was sent out several months ago with transcripts)  
N:    The Corp. of Army Engineers one?
R:    Mumhumm
N:    Have you used those yet?
R:    Oh yeah!
N:    I’ve got a copy of those here.  You just send those to the people that won’t release the product?
R:    It’s when you have the electronic funds transfer, they’re tampering with it because they’ve taken the exemption and somebody is responsible for that.  We’re going to go after the cardinals and the bishops in this country for any of these discrepancies.  
N:    Well it’s calling the whole darn system to account daggonit anyway.  HJR-192 made this provision for people that want to live this way and then they want to stand in bar and hinder you.  It’s got to come to a stop.
R:    Yeah, yeah, yeah!  They’re hypocrites.  
N:    Right all of them.  We were walking out of the court today and they were taking all of our pictures.
R:    Oh you know what you do?  You bring your own camera.  And you tell them… you take my picture … I take yours.  What you want to do is you want to request all of the films and pictures until they come to settlement with you for using those.   You see what you ought to do is get somebody to take pictures that come and go from that courtroom and then later on let them know that their mug shot is going to appear on the internet with an account of who they are and where they live if they don’t hand over the negatives and any pictures that they’ve taken.  
N:    Yeah, they were taking pictures of everybody today.
R:    Yeah and you wait and see what happens to everybody when you take their pictures.
N:    Well we’re going to have a lot of fun with those people in the county seat.  They’re not going to like it but daggonit anyway they started it.   We were perfectly willing to move on.  Oh here’s a good one for you.  You’ll like this.  Costco… we all wrote checks to Costco and of course they sent out their insanity and their letters and all that.  We accepted and returned everything and they told us our membership was blocked and all that kind of stuff.   We went back to the store and there is no record that our membership had ever been blocked.
R:    Yeah you’ve got a lying attorney in there and an accountant.
N:    Humhum yep so we asked, “Wasn’t there a problem?”  They say, “Don’t show anything in the record.”     I’m looking forward to the day when we can get rid of this whole thing called commerce and they make us all gladiators and fight each other in this arena called commerce.
R:    We’re going to make them the gladiators…   Chuckling
N:    One step at a time….   All right.  Well thank you ever so much.  I know I told you that before but I appreciate you.