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Credo Mutwa Reptilians


December 11, 2002 - Transcript of conversation with Roger Elvick
J* and B* calling Roger re the different court events from this week.  J* regarding the purchase of 2 pickup trucks and them keeping the checks but taking the vehicles back by force.  E* regarding her hearing re paying off her mortgage with private check and P* regarding writing private checks for purchase and being held in custody.

J*    I just want to tell you today I went to court and what they did.  They brought their witnesses in and I did my direct exams on all of them plus both of the attorney’s, states attorneys that were there.  They both said they did not have a claim against me.  
R:    Okay.
J*    Then I requested the motion to dismiss for the finding of facts and conclusion of law and the judge said that he will give them to me and I requested that I wanted a judicial record but he said he is moving this up to circuit court.
R:    Oh he is is he?  
J*    That’s what he said.
R:    You didn’t happen to ask him for his voucher for his finding of fact and conclusion of law?
J*    No I’ve been asking…   He’s totally refused everything.
R:    Okay well see at that point, now you see you’ve got him because he is in dishonor when you request that.  So with his dishonor you see he has now authorized discovery of his personal assets and so that’s the position.  Now, this guy, I would imagine has to be with good standing with the Bar to be able to operate in court the way he is.
J*    Are you talking about this case today?
R:    Yeah.
J*    Well I did a complaint on him to the Bar Association cause he’s in breach of contract.
R:    You did what?
J*    I did that disciplinary action against the judge and the attorney through the Bar Association.  
R:    Yep!  Okay.  So when you do that, what you want to do is set up a time and location for them to appear.
J*    …For the disciplinary action?   
R:    Yeah so you can depose them.  When you depose them there is only one thing you depose them for… the 3 magic questions and the voucher.  Are you in good standing with the Bar?  Where is your proof of payment?  In other words the proof of payment has to be made to you for the damages and if you don’t have those he is subject to being charged by the Bar.  If the Bar or these Bar Lawyers fail to investigate then they are then subject to a discovery of their personal assets.   We’ll probably have to go to the Secretary of State, the methods there of charging them by information.
J*    Okay.
R:    Okay… anyway we don’t have to get into that for now.  
J*    Now the circuit court I’m going to stick with the same program then?
R:    Yeah!  Because the minute somebody comes with an order… see what he’s done is he has dishonored you by deferral.  He’s deferred which means that he has refused to pay the taxes.  He is now a tax fugitive and he’s delinquent.  
J*    Right!  Okay!   Got that.
R:    And so anyway in the next, I suppose you can even draw up and ex-parte order for sanctions into that court action and serve it on him and let the judgment be for whatever amount the damages result in this court are placed against him and all of his personal assets and I would think that we may be able to start getting this stuff filed in the appropriate courts and in the county where it is going to really tie his property up.  
J*    Good!  They are really moving fast on this.  I’ve got to go back on the 17th again.  I don’t know why I just have a feeling…  Well I knew today I did fine.  I did exactly what I was suppose to do but I just didn’t feel….  Well I don’t have a good feeling about this.  I feel like they’re going to try and railroad me.
R:    Oh sure!  Oh Yeah!  Oh they have to because they’re in serious trouble!  They are in serious trouble cause they’re looking at charges coming against them.  All of these guys in these actions now are walking on the very edge.  
J*    I agree with that.  
R:    You see and that’s what they do.  See the more sophisticated they get the closer to the edge they get.  So we just need to implement methods that always continue to show their dishonor.  In other words what they are doing, any and all.  Then what the judge did when he refused the remedy and he deferred, what he did is he created a disguise for his confederates to enter the local community to rape and plunder.  
J*    Okay!
R:    And I would use that language cause he has opened the door to bring in racketeering elements that are coming into the local community under a disguise that was given by him in his dishonor of the matter in court and I think we need to describe these things in some very good detail like this and get these to be stuff that is entered into court and then can circulate quite a little really doing in the guys representation.  
J*    Good!  That sounds good to me!  Well I’m going to go back and I’m going to stick with the same program but this time I’m going to ask for the check and the voucher right away.   (chuckles)  The last time when I went in front of the Magistrate I requested the order of the court be released and he said, “What order?” and I said, “The assessment and the charges.”
R:    YES!  Yes!  
J*    After I thought about it I thought well I’m still okay here because the assessment is the check so…
R:    Yes… yes it is!  It’s the voucher!  And if he can’t provide that he has admitted – he has admitted in front of witnesses that he has dishonored this court.  He has opened the door or he has provided a disguise for his confederates to enter the local community.
J*    All right.  
R:    You know something like that, I’m not so sure that what we can’t as a matter of procedure, the minute they do this when you get out of the court is to call 9-1-1 and report it.   Report it as a terrorist tactic that is being implemented right in the court by these guys that create a disguise for their confederates to enter the local community and to loot and plunder private property.
J*    That sounds good to me.
R:    I think with that you could get your statement written down so when you make the 9 1 1 call that that goes in because I’m sure they take it on tape.  
J*    Yeah I’m sure they do too.  Well I know they’re supposed to.  I know that J* tried to get his but they wouldn’t give it to him.
R:    Wouldn’t give him what?
J*    Oh they wouldn’t take his 9 1 1 call.
R:    Oh when you make a 9 1 1 call that’s taken.  
J*    Right I know.  It’s automatically recorded, I believe.
R:    Yep it’s there and if he refuses, that’s all right.  Just tell him, “Thank you for your confession.”
J*    (chuckles)  Sounds good to me!  Okay I’m going to do the chapter 11.  I’m working on that now because I do have the book and I’ve got the initial filing done.  On my reorganization plan do I have to submit that when I file the 11?… or do I have time to do that?
R:    Oh you’ve got time to do it.  You’ve got like 120 days.  See the reorganization plan will be amended later as it reveals.
J*    Got that.
R:    Okay then just state that the plan is to make settlement with all creditors, both secured and unsecured.    And something else---  Your unsecured creditors, whenever they start to get redundant and they refuse to take the set-offs, or the checks, well when they call you, you can let them know that “you sir are making a claim and attempting to convert M2 money into M1 money and that’s fraud.”  Just stuff it in their nose and just let these people know… the ones that are using the phones to make these calls.  My phone has gotten pretty quiet from those kind of calls.
J*    Actually my phone is quiet too.  I’m really surprised.  Okay… My main concern was the court and I don’t want to take up too much of your time.
R:    That’s okay.
J*    My concern was when they moved it up to circuit and I thought… well I just got this feeling they were going to railroad me.
R:    Okay…  Well here is a matter of tactic.  Whatever you run into.  See I know people that have gone in and laid there demands down and tell them, “I request this…or this … or this”.  If you’re going to make any requests, what you do is you do it on paper and then you can lay it down and whoever you put it in front of then you tell them, “Well I’m requesting what’s on that paper.”  What they try to do is they always try to change the subject and bring on something else…
J*    Yep!
R:    Or they may even serve you another paper and tell them, “we’ll get to that matter after you take care of this that’s on the paper.”   In other words, fall back on your paperwork.  
J*    Right!  I do that.  I have my little program all set up.
R:    Another thing is get into the habit of telling them, when they’re speaking to you, and they are asking if you’re ‘she’?  Then you say, “Well I’m the representative of ‘she’.”
J*    Okay!  Well I’ve been using I’m the Authorized Representative.  I used that in court today.   At least I feel like I’m on the right track.
R:    Well let’s just hope that it’s enough.   
J*    Like I said, I don’t know I don’t have a good feeling about what they are doing at court but I’m going to just stick with the program.   The bottom line is everything I requested in court he refused.
R:    Okay well then get to using the word ‘dishonor’.  “Well then sir you are dishonoring this here or that there.”
J*    I did.  I just told them, “I accept your dishonor.  The remedy I want is the dismissal, you know, release and delivery.”  And he just ignored.
R:    Okay now this is what, a state judge?
J*    All these hearing I’ve gone through are district court now they’ve moved it up to a state circuit court.
R:    You say it’s a State Circuit not moved into a federal?
J*    No it’s state.
R:    Well the word Superior is like Mother Superior.  See that’s when they are going to start using the spiritual aspect.  
J*    Yeah well it’s still at the state level.  Now it’s a felony charge is what it is.  There’s two felony charges though.
R:    Okay well then you’re up one octave from misdemeanors.  But you have class A, B, and C misdemeanors, then you have class A, B, C felonies.  But you see it’s like going from the regular fund you’re going into the greater fund.   You’re going into the super fund then.  See you’re going up an octave.   That’s all it is.
J*    All right.  
R:    Now when they’re talking about felonies, see felony as opposed to misdemeanor simple means that you’re taking evidence in indirectly then.   That’s really the only difference.  
J*    Okay.
B*    Well if you guys have got it resolved I need to tell R about going into court yesterday with E* about her house.  They’re trying to do a default because she paid the court fees with closed check… anyway to bring you up to speed on what is going on.  Last time the attorney of record wasn’t there but she did manage to depose the ‘stand-in’ who said she didn’t have a claim and didn’t know anyone who had a claim.  Right after that is when the judge asked this attorney for the bank if she was the attorney of record, then informed her that the case will not be heard unless the attorney of record is there.  Anyway this time he was plus he brought another attorney with him.  Well he called the case and the attorney’s strut up there and introduce themselves, Ethel takes her time, strolls up there, sets her brief case on the table then tells him her name and says Attorney in Fact.  The judge immediately turned up the volume on his voice and asked her, “What is an Attorney in Fact?”  Ethel calmly says, “It’s the Authorized Representative.”  Then she asked his name.  The judge went ballistic.  He started yelling… “Get her out of here!”  Meanwhile she did happen to slide the Bar Complaint over to the bank’s attorney.  As she is leaving there were 3 others and we all started to leave with her and I said as she was coming through the bar… “You forgot to ask him if he has a claim.”  So she turned around and went back through the bar and asked him, “Do you have a claim against me?”  I thought he was going to come off his chair.  He started yelling to get the bailiffs up there and get her out of there.  He started pushing this button under his desk you’d think we were threatening somebody…   There was this little gal that said you have to leave and I commented that the court was operating in bad faith and with unclean hands and should be shut down and Ethel repeated it to the judge.  He was a waving his arms and we went out and start going to the elevator because we were on the 6th floor and this little gal said you can’t leave.  I said, “oh yes I can and I’m going to” then she said, “Well then I’m going down the elevator with you.”  I said, “Fine” but the sheriffs showed up and she pointed us out and the sheriffs escorted us down the elevator and out the building.   We did leave a couple of plants in there though so they could tell us what happened when we left.
R:    Yeah!  Good!
B*    Well the plant told us that the judge was going to give them their default so now she’s sort of wondering…  since she’s already accepted everything they are just the holders for her so what can they really do but block her from freely using her property?
R:    Well I don’t know…
B*    She needs to get into the chapter 11 ASAP but if she gets the voucher or check for the property that would only be $119,000 and her property is worth $450,000 or somewhere in there.  
R:    Okay well if they give her $119,000 she signs it and pays them.  Now the property is free.  
B*    Perfect.  I should of seen that!   That makes sense.  Then the other thing is if she does the chapter 11 we’re trying to figure out how to get this filed by using the delinquent creditor paying or can we use a closed account check?
R:    There has been people I guess that have done it.  But you see the filings should be made, well when you’re filing the chapter 11 that’s an $830.00 filing fee, so what you want to do is, look at the provisions in there to file by installments or whatever.  The thing is, you don’t need to file by the installments but you instruct in your business plan the court or filing officer to charge the fee to the creditors of the action and you see you’re going to have as an exhibit some bill that is signed by some of these characters.  
B*    Right… making the claim?
R:    Yes!   So you instruct the clerk of the court to charge that particular credit account because you own that account at that point.  You’re debtor in possession.  That’s why you state filing chapter 11 reorganization in bankruptcy, debtor in possession.  Okay so the debtor in possession is instructing the clerk to charge the fee from that particular account see.  If they’re making a claim on you that’s larger then $830.00 they have a claim there that can just be lifted as credit if nothing else.  But you see they need to charge the individual.   You see and to charge the individual for the filing fee.
B*    Okay I can see where that makes sense.   Also I was talking to PJ and him and JM were reading a lot about bankruptcy and he told me they found in the code books that for the person to answer a claim they had to submit a voucher to the bankruptcy court.  
R:    Yes!   Okay and then state that right in the plan that the creditor must submit a voucher with their claim and you will be using that for the filing as per the bankruptcy code.   Something like that.
B*    Now what happens with the people you send out a notice to about your intent to file a bankruptcy chapter 11 reorganization and you said we should take them one at a time and after you file and notice the delinquent creditors and they want to then try to settle and put the rush on you.
R:    Okay then what we do is we request that the stay be removed and that the marshals be ordered to liquidate the property.  
B*    Then it would be much more then the original claim…
R:    Who cares.  Who cares what they liquidate it for because the debtor is going reserve the right to reject any and all bids which he will do because he’s debtor in possession and we’ll just liquidate the creditors position.   In other words liquidate the property and then the debtor in possession reserves the right to reject any and all bids so if they make any of their BS bids on it we just take that into reserve and keep the bids and the money and the property both.  
B*    We were talking about some of these companies and how many other little companies they own.  Like Wells Fargo, GE Capitol and then also Golden West, Golden Empire and I think Norwest is in there.  And you’re right… Norwest is in Ohio.  
R:    Yes!  And Norwest owns Wells Fargo.  
B*    Okay.  We thought it looked just the opposite.   We thought Wells Fargo owned Norwest because they said they owned GE Capitol.   All of their addresses are at 1 Parkway, someplace in Ohio.  When the gal from GE Capitol called E* she told her that Wells Fargo owned them.  Anyway we were thinking when we start doing this bankruptcy and you have the sheriff liquidate, gosh the ownership of one company could solve quite a bit or they have all these different tentacles that they fragment and you can’t find who owns who or what.
R:      Well we’re going to need to slam dunk some of these judges here when they come on us like that.  We need to get him in and list him in the bankruptcy and give him the bankruptcy notice under the seal of the court when it’s filed.  Just fill out the forms and in the forms you’re going to list these people for the amounts and the thing is, the amounts are going to be like, say where they live and the amount of the mortgage and if there isn’t one available, estimate one and put it on there.
B*    Okay.  See that’s one of the things C* had found under the judge that was making all the decisions on her social security, she finds out that he is not a judge at all, he doesn’t have a bar license, he doesn’t have any kind of credentials but he’s setting in a judges position.  Nobody will do anything about it.  She even contacted her congressman and he has almost the same kind of list at the county recorder under his name.   It’s listed under assigned rents.
R:    Well I heard something interesting on the radio yesterday or day before.  It was a talk show and it was a talk show host and they were commenting about Homeland Security and they were stating the reasons why Homeland Security now was for Bush to bring these rogue corporations into submission and punishment for wrecking the US economy.  
B*    That’s sure a different take then what these demoncats have to say about it.  Many think that what he’s doing is taking all the freedoms away from the sovereigns.  
R:    It may just be that the time has run to the end for these people running this ring of terror cause that’s what it is and all these actions that you run into there you could turn it into an incident report.
B*    That’s what we were going to do yesterday when they chased us out of court and left her with no remedy while they’re in there conspiring against her property.  We thought we could just write up affidavits of what took place and what we witnessed.
R:    You don’t even have to do that.  Just get on the phone and just call 911 and tell them that this person has threatened me.  Then get a short statement so you know who it is and where it occurred and you’ll get part of it and they’ll say oh we can’t do anything like that and then just tell them, “Okay, well thank you for your confession to taking the report.”  You see because it is an incident report as a matter of fact!  See that’s what they’re trying to avoid… is the state maintaining subject matter jurisdiction in fact and that’s what those Incident Reports do.  Those Incident Reports cross those borders.  An angle incident is two intersecting lines that cross (a foreign border) on the plane.
    The other thing is you accuse them of them creating a disguise to allow their confederates to creep into the local community to loot and plunder the personal property they can find.  Because we need to concoct statements like that because they always try to cover it up with volumes and volumes of redundant of things they are accusing people of.  We just need to be very concise and state, “well that is totally redundant and irrelevant.  You’re creating a disguise for all your confederates to creep into the local community to carry on their racketeering and criminal enterprise.”  
B*    Oh I like that.  We can do letters stating that.
R:    Yeah and like you were in court there’s lots of other ears there.  Even to those in uniform.  Lot’s of them are probably thinking, ‘yeah give it to them!’
B*    That’s funny!  The court reporter when E* deposed that ‘stand in’ attorney and the court reporter just smiled while she was taking it down.  
R:    Oh yes.  They like to see that because they know what miserable repulsive they are and I know some of these people in there would like to see a house cleaning.  
B*    The other thing that is going on now that’s pretty hot is the lady over in Idaho who is in jail for writing checks.  They did fax in the complaint to the Bar Association and to the court but they didn’t release her on that.   The only thing they did do was to move her into a better cell and away from the general population.  Today was supposed to be her hearing and I haven’t heard from anyone yet.  Her husband is willing to bail her out but she’s willing to stay if it means sticking to the principals but if it’s going to be long term…..
R:    We don’t know!  
B*    Also what’s going on with the Idaho people is almost identical with what happened with you regarding the Appearance Bond and pleading guilty.  Well the judge is willing to give them appearance bonds and tells them they can plead guilty and now is scheduling time for them to come and be sentenced.  Now this is making them a little nervous about is he going to separate the flesh from the paper and is he going to see this as the shadow for the strawman or what is going to happen?
R:    Well that’s what he needs to be….  See that’s what I didn’t do was I didn’t make it clear that I’m the representative for Roger Elvick.  In fact I was preparing something along that line.  (This is on a separate letter included with this transcript.)
B*    Oh you are putting his name in there exactly twice?
R:    Yes because one of them they are holding illegally, which one is it?  Now we’re going to make them identify which one.  So you might take that to heart and figure out your ways of just shoving this right in there nose and asking them, “Which one of these people are you holding? …  And are you telling me there is only one of these?”
B*    You know there is so much in government that is nothing but reflection.  Look at Washington DC… they have reflection ponds everywhere.  
R:    Pools…  Public pools.
B*    I guess it is out there in the open we just don’t know there codes…. More disguises!
R:    Some of them are transvestites…. Creatures of disguise.  They change from one side to the other.  
B*    Oh I’m thinking of male to female.  (chuckles)
R:    Well that’s a change.  Sometimes they’re male and sometimes they’re female.
B*    Yep we’ve got our hands full.  R*C* has never been charged has he?  
R:    No!  
B*    They’ve had him in there over a year!
R:    Yeah and they’ve kept putting him off and we’ve given them some pretty rough stuff and he’s getting to do the chapter 11.  His wife just served the USM 285 on them just a couple days ago.  
B*    Right I did talk to her and she said she just got back from taking three of them to the Marshals.  
R:    Okay now here’s the thing.  If the marshals try an beg off I think we’re going to do, see what they do is they use one of the deputies in there practicing law saying, “Oh we can’t do this.”  Then we have to be ready to tell them, “Well Mr. Deputy you’re practicing law without a license.”  Okay the way we get at them you see is that the Attorney General and as far as the US Marshal, we could either send the local states attorney or the US Attorney General and bring him up on a disciplinary complaint to the Bar Association because they are allowing this deputy to use their name to practice law in the local community.   See they have to be in good standing or they can’t bring these charges.  I’ve noticed in a lot of these pleadings that this man is turned over to the Attorney General but they never state who he is and they don’t give his bar number and we’re going to ask for that so that we can bring them up on the disciplinary actions with the Bar Association.   They are in fact practicing law in the local community without a license.
B*    In California they are required to have their bar license on the complaint but I’m not sure about the DA.
R:    Yes.  Some of them do by somebody else!  So we will take those and we’ll use those, but you see the Marshals Service is trying to get by with just a deputy stating it.  
B*    Another thing we learned to is when the plant stayed in the court and heard the judge with his decision and this woman was stating something and the judge chimed in to help her add some comments to her statements…. Little practicing law from the bench.
R:    Okay here’s the thing.  The way to overcome that is if they state that a closed check was used, which is a set-off, okay what determines the value of a set-off is the offer so you Sir, are you saying the offer was no good and fraudulent?  That’s what you’re saying if you’re saying the check was no good.  The check is based on the exact mirror image of the offer.  
B*    Right!
R:    So what are you saying?
B*    Lately people have been telling me that they are getting noticed that the account can’t be found, or there are a couple others that I don’t recall right now.
R:    Well here’s how to overcome that.  Insure it at the post office before you give it to them.  Then we’ll just turn it over as a lost item to the post office.  I did that with one the other day.  See they can’t find the account because it’s private and that’s covered by the privacy act.  So they’re confessing to the reality of it and if they haven’t done the electronic funds on it then they are delinquent and that’s a dishonor.  
B*    Okay!
R:    So when they say it can’t be found, say, “Yeah that’s right because they’re public and it falls under the Privacy Act”…  So now what else you got to say Buddy?   Chuckles.
B*    Oh another thing that is going on by these banksters like Providian and there may be others but they are contacting people from the fraud division wanting copies of their social security card and of their driver license and whatever else.  They’re making it sound like, ‘oh we wouldn’t be investigating you we just want to make sure you’re not a victim of a theft.’  You know how they love to help us?
R:    Yeah!  The Providian people are doing this.  Well we’ll just have to find a way to REALLY, really ruin their business for doing that.  
B*    You know when C* had her purse taken and she called the police and they were looking at all the checks she’d written and telling her that the thief had taken it before she had reported it and told her about other checks from previous days and she say, “No that was Me.  I wrote those checks from my private account.”   The cops don’t know what or how to handle her cause she is so open and gets right in their face with what they are suppose to be doing.  I’m thinking of telling these bank investigators to tell them that it’s our private account and if I need you to investigate this I’ll call you.
R:    That’s good.  Yeah!
B*    Well good we’ve got a lot of good information covered.  So the only thing left is the guys up in Idaho that are suppose to go in for pleading guilty and sentencing, should they go in or not?
R:    What do you mean?  Go in for sentencing?
B*    Well that’s when N* told that he didn’t dispute any of the facts and that he wants an appearance bond so he can plead.  He asked for the finding of facts so he knows what he is pleading to.  The judge said he could have one and now it is scheduled for next week to go in and plead and for the sentencing.  
R:    Naw I wouldn’t go in on that.  Have them serve them on me because he hasn’t got any service yet to come and you see what’s he doing?  Is he dealing with these people orally?  
B*    Yeah I think that he went in and talked to the prosecutor but I think there might be 2 different ones.  
R:    Well that’s his problem right there…
B*    Okay he went in instead of having the trauma in front of his family.
R:    Yeah I know but he’s going to be sure cause he’s going to contribute to it.   What they’re doing is they’re trying to get an assessment because they don’t have it.  Who knows, they may trump up other ways of getting at him, but he’s damn sure not going to stop this by what he’s doing.